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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 48 post(s) |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2402
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
Posting in a thread where goons helped me make 8.7b isk last saturday for 4 hours play.
(they really ruined my sandbox)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
The Slayer wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Posting in a thread where goons helped me make 8.7b isk last saturday for 4 hours play.
(they really ruined my sandbox)
Oh thats precious, a whole 8 billion? Aren't you sweet. *rolls around in 300trillion isk money bin*
Well hey, I'm just an average eve gamer rather than some kind of superfreak uber numbers guy. 8.7b is quite a lot for me, its about the most I ever made with PVE to be honest.
Will keep me in fleet stabbers for a while
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
Courthouse wrote:Posting in a thread where Jade's so dumb he literally made 1/100 of what the jewbal made based solely on his huge effort eve online gaming rewards and not intelligent use of game mechanics.
what you mean by playing the game for 4 hours.
It really wasn't that onerous and I'm obviously not as greedy as you guys
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
The Slayer wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Posting in a thread where goons helped me make 8.7b isk last saturday for 4 hours play.
(they really ruined my sandbox)
Hey Jade. http://i.imgur.com/dtMk4.png<3
Seriously though I usually don't like you guys (leadership anyway) this kind of thing is clever use of the mechanics and seeing an opportunity and well, congrats tbh. If you can make the game work for you like this then fair enough.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
Dyllyn wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Posting in a thread where goons helped me make 8.7b isk last saturday for 4 hours play.
(they really ruined my sandbox)
Perhaps you missed the bit where they made sum of ISK greater than the value of every titan in the game put together.
I really didn't and I don't mind much either :) Like I said, it was pretty clever.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:19:00 -
[6] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:Ituhata Saken wrote:Dearest Market-Interested Space Tycoons,
At downtime today we made an adjustment to the average price of some items in order to curb a situation whereby the average price of an item could be manipulated in order to create a disparity between the value of an item in Isk and its value in Loyalty Point payouts. There will be additional changes in how this system works in the future. We will be monitoring for attempted manipulation of the LP market and will reverse any proceeds deemed to have been obtained through manipulative means. We are watching you. DonGÇÖt be That Guy.
By way of explanation we addressed the manipulation issue but haven't yet completed the investigation into the scope of the abuse. Once that happens I'm pretty sure some people are going to be a bit less smug about the money they made that one time when there was a bank error in their favor and then lost again when the bank fixed the glitch.
Serious question Sreegs, is this kind of thing actually cheating ? (ie against the rules) I read their document a couple of nights ago and though sure it really did blow massive holes through the eve game mechanics in order to make a giant profit - was it actually illegal ?
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:22:00 -
[7] - Quote
Kyle Myr wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Posting in a thread where goons helped me make 8.7b isk last saturday for 4 hours play.
(they really ruined my sandbox)
Enjoy FW without us propping you up. We appreciate helping lock all those people into a forever war with us. You did good work.
awww but they are all going to be gone 2 weeks after 1.1 hits and the defensive allies are nerfed. The forever war is going to be a pale shadow of a dead thing.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:25:00 -
[8] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Serious question Sreegs, is this kind of thing actually cheating ? (ie against the rules) I read their document a couple of nights ago and though sure it really did blow massive holes through the eve game mechanics in order to make a giant profit - was it actually illegal ?
jade i'm pretty sure you didn't read a document written a day ago several days ago
okay it would have been in the early hours of wed morning so lets say so a day and a half ago (or two nights) - which in english means "a couple" ... sometimes Weasoliar you are so nitpicky its positively cringworthy.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:I read their document a couple of nights ago You "read our document", eh? A few days ago, eh? I guess that means you didn't actually make 8.7b, then, since that document was literally released 1 hour ago.
why are you goons incapable of understand that a couple = two whereas few and several tends to mean 3+
The original leak of your document was in the early hours of wed morning FYI
And for reference ... I made my isk by cashing out my loyalty points at the minmatar store when it hit tier 5 on saturday quite legally turning my points into datacores and fleet stabbers. At that point I had no idea whatsoever about your shennagins - it was just happy coincidence.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:30:00 -
[10] - Quote
Kyle Myr wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:Ituhata Saken wrote:Dearest Market-Interested Space Tycoons,
At downtime today we made an adjustment to the average price of some items in order to curb a situation whereby the average price of an item could be manipulated in order to create a disparity between the value of an item in Isk and its value in Loyalty Point payouts. There will be additional changes in how this system works in the future. We will be monitoring for attempted manipulation of the LP market and will reverse any proceeds deemed to have been obtained through manipulative means. We are watching you. DonGÇÖt be That Guy.
By way of explanation we addressed the manipulation issue but haven't yet completed the investigation into the scope of the abuse. Once that happens I'm pretty sure some people are going to be a bit less smug about the money they made that one time when there was a bank error in their favor and then lost again when the bank fixed the glitch. Serious question Sreegs, is this kind of thing actually cheating ? (ie against the rules) I read their document a couple of nights ago and though sure it really did blow massive holes through the eve game mechanics in order to make a giant profit - was it actually illegal ? Jade, lying is against the TOS. You're not good enough to have spies in the group that did this.
Keep telling yourself that lol ...
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|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:30:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:Ituhata Saken wrote:Dearest Market-Interested Space Tycoons,
At downtime today we made an adjustment to the average price of some items in order to curb a situation whereby the average price of an item could be manipulated in order to create a disparity between the value of an item in Isk and its value in Loyalty Point payouts. There will be additional changes in how this system works in the future. We will be monitoring for attempted manipulation of the LP market and will reverse any proceeds deemed to have been obtained through manipulative means. We are watching you. DonGÇÖt be That Guy.
By way of explanation we addressed the manipulation issue but haven't yet completed the investigation into the scope of the abuse. Once that happens I'm pretty sure some people are going to be a bit less smug about the money they made that one time when there was a bank error in their favor and then lost again when the bank fixed the glitch. Serious question Sreegs, is this kind of thing actually cheating ? (ie against the rules) I read their document a couple of nights ago and though sure it really did blow massive holes through the eve game mechanics in order to make a giant profit - was it actually illegal ? I don't really want to say just yet, but basically if you know you're using a system in a certain way in order to gain massive resources, whether you're taking advantage of a design flaw or not and whether we classify it as an exploit or not we're still well within our rights to fix the glitch. I'm not going to comment on what we do or don't do at this point because I don't prejudge the results of investigations.
Fair enough, thanks for the response.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Treyan Argund wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Weaselior wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Serious question Sreegs, is this kind of thing actually cheating ? (ie against the rules) I read their document a couple of nights ago and though sure it really did blow massive holes through the eve game mechanics in order to make a giant profit - was it actually illegal ?
jade i'm pretty sure you didn't read a document written a day ago several days ago okay it would have been in the early hours of wed morning so lets say so a day and a half ago (or two nights) - which in english means "a couple" ... sometimes Weasoliar you are so nitpicky its positively cringworthy. Document was posted on GF.com literally an hour ago. Please damage control some more, it's cute.
That means you guys were amongst the last to know ... thats actually quite funny.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:33:00 -
[13] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Maggie Maggie wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote: I don't really want to say just yet, but basically if you know you're using a system in a certain way in order to gain massive resources, whether you're taking advantage of a design flaw or not and whether we classify it as an exploit or not we're still well within our rights to fix the glitch. I'm not going to comment on what we do or don't do at this point because I don't prejudge the results of investigations.
Tech moons are a design flaw. Everyone has known it for years. When you're ready to classify it as an exploit, let us know, k? They should correct the flaw and than confiscate all the ill-gotten gains.
See I'd actually vote for you again if you ran for the next CSM with that campaign pledge!
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:34:00 -
[14] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:The original leak of your document was in the early hours of wed morning FYI Nope.
I'm afraid to say you know nothing.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:41:00 -
[15] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:That means you guys were amongst the last to know ... thats actually quite funny. I'm actually 100% certain you're 100% full of ****. But again, please do keep on pouring on the damage control, you're pretty bad at it.
https://twitter.com/EVEAryth/status/215233678631116801
any comments?
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2403
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:49:00 -
[16] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:You know, if Jade does have sources in GSF leadership it would explain why he stated he knew for a fact GSF leadership were afraid of a foreverwar :V
If by "sources" you mean "follows twiiter leaks" then lol :)
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2404
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:55:00 -
[17] - Quote
Aryth wrote:Weaselior wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:That means you guys were amongst the last to know ... thats actually quite funny. I'm actually 100% certain you're 100% full of ****. But again, please do keep on pouring on the damage control, you're pretty bad at it. https://twitter.com/EVEAryth/status/215233678631116801any comments? ...it was aryth aryth tweeted the secret documents oh god this is even funnier than the lp I am so bad at twitter. And the really crappy part. She told me to go fish
Well I guess the good thing for you guys is it did at least look like you were trying to report the issue before it went nuts.
http://www.mordante.aquiss.com/BreakFW.jpg
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2404
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 17:57:00 -
[18] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:seriously i was leakhunting with the timeline jade gave us and then someone linked the twitter and I've been nearly crying with laughter at work for like fifteen minutes
Well I did say I just "knew about it" I wasn't making a great claim for having elite spais in your dirty tricks division!
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2404
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 18:02:00 -
[19] - Quote
Aryth wrote:I had actually reported the issue to CCP in it's first form 2 weeks ago. They have known to some degree what we have been doing for quite some time. I assume the first hotfix to cargo drops were a part of that.
Well regardless of what CCP decide in the end (even if they take all the isk back) it was a clever plan and congrats to you guys for keeping it quiet so long. And if they don't take the isk back you should give it to me so I can fund the foreverwar for 1 month against the new 1.1 wardec allied escalation fees!
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2408
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 18:32:00 -
[20] - Quote
Aja Jinn wrote: So, What are you goons going to do with all the trillions of EVE Online space bucks? Will you be wearing special custom made space clothes? Titans for everyone? Gold plated rifters? How will we Know your specialness?
They could pay for 20 defensive allies in the Inferno 1.1 wardec system for 2 weeks!
The best use for 5 trillion ISK
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2410
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 18:39:00 -
[21] - Quote
Cipher Jones wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:Ituhata Saken wrote:Dearest Market-Interested Space Tycoons,
At downtime today we made an adjustment to the average price of some items in order to curb a situation whereby the average price of an item could be manipulated in order to create a disparity between the value of an item in Isk and its value in Loyalty Point payouts. There will be additional changes in how this system works in the future. We will be monitoring for attempted manipulation of the LP market and will reverse any proceeds deemed to have been obtained through manipulative means. We are watching you. DonGÇÖt be That Guy.
By way of explanation we addressed the manipulation issue but haven't yet completed the investigation into the scope of the abuse. Once that happens I'm pretty sure some people are going to be a bit less smug about the money they made that one time when there was a bank error in their favor and then lost again when the bank fixed the glitch. OP admits that his alliance broke the EULA by exploiting. Again. And CCP lets them stay. And its directly because you cant afford to ban them. Absolutely disgusting. Consider me unsubbed.
Look, I don't like goonswarm either but I also don't like people who use the term "exploit" wrongly (which is basically in advance of CCP game developers / gms ruling a situation "an exploit" - The developer in question "CCP Sreegs" has come and posted he's conducting an investigation and will make his mind up after he's looked at all the facts.
Give the guy a chance for heavens sake and don't go howling "exploit exploit" before something is officially categorized an "exploit" ... only very stupid people do that.
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2410
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 18:50:00 -
[22] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:i mean, if sreegs finds the jewbal in unfortunate error of breaking the rules/using an exploit and doing so with the express intent of making money, one might say that jade did the same thing (although to a lesser degree) when he found the twitter message some two days ago.
Well hardly. Seeing as how the tweet in question was directed at CCP through Punkuris in the early hours of Wed Morning and I (like many other Minmatar Militia pilots) made our cash out on Sat the weekend before.
Stil, IF - there was some super harsh rollback on this stuff you could argue that ALL militia store cashouts should be reverted and if that happens I'd lose my lovely fleet stabber blueprint collection, my fleet tempest bpcs, and a bunch of minmatar starship engineeering datacores that are sat in Dal.
Lord knows how they'd do that though - would be one of the biggest rollbacks since the Exodus fleet fight fiasco.
Still your logic fails "Blawrf" on the fact I made my money before I found the tweet :)
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2410
|
Posted - 2012.06.21 18:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
Pyrus Octavius wrote:I hate to say this, but I feel really stupid. Never in a million years would I have figured out something like this. Obviously, not all men are created equally (and I use men loosely because most of you grown ups still act like children).
My personal feeling regardless is, any gains made in this fashion should be confiscated. I don't think I care about bans, but the gains be taken away. I'm not a market guru what so ever, and even though someone said in here that the market would return to normal in 30 days, the whole system was manipulated, and this hurts innocent bystanders, whom will never get their ISK back.
It's stuff like this that also has just made me not enjoy playing EVE too much. Log in check toon, say hi, change skill, log. That's my routine. Hoping that someday things will get to a better state where I feel the time I invest in sitting in front of my computer will be rewarding. Until then...
You should join Minmatar faction warfare, sometimes all this crazy market manipulation high finance shennanigans-in-the-sky just randomly makes 10m isk fleet stabbers fall in your lap and you can content yourself by having fun and not worrying about how much the 0.0 aristocray have got. Play a cybernetic rat in the wainscotting of Eve Online, sometimes even rats have a good day.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 00:06:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ninlarra wrote:Weaselior wrote:irl, not just in eve Eve, yea sure why not, it means nothing. IRL I doubt it, but I'm not going to waste my time going tit or tat with you on an obscure forum about a game a couple of hundred thousand people play. Point is, in the grand scheme of things, w/e you do is completely irrelevant, cuase your space gold will soon be gone, and your account well soon be ban hammered. Good day space hero. I'm sure your mom thinks you're cool though.
In real life I'm the King of Sweden actually (true story.)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 01:41:00 -
[25] - Quote
Marconus Orion wrote:This is about as much of a game exploit as Jade doing a forever war against goons.
It's not an exploit guys.
Only likely difference is our lovely forever war is getting horribly and totally nerfed :(
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 02:06:00 -
[26] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Marconus Orion wrote:This is about as much of a game exploit as Jade doing a forever war against goons.
It's not an exploit guys. Only likely difference is our lovely forever war is getting horribly and totally nerfed :( The FW thing also got horribly and totally nerfed.
That bit I don't quite understand - ie exactly how it was possible to stop this happening again ... what was done?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 11:40:00 -
[27] - Quote
saltrock0000 wrote:So CCP just totaly went against thier entire ethos.
"Eve is a sandbox"
Yet CCP changed the average price of items on the market. Not very much of a sandbox if you ask me, CCP should pick a stance on the whole thing and stick to it, not allow alot of lets be honest bannable things because "eves a sandbox" and then act on others because "eves a sandbox".
Goons really opened my eyes to what a hypocritical company CCP is, picking the line "eves a sandbox" when they cant be bother'd to act on something, like say, hulkageddon or griefing. Then instantly jumping on something like this.
All goons did to my understanding was play the games withing the rules, with some amrket manipulation afterall eves a sandbox.
Byt the way did i mention "EVES A SANDBOX"
Well its not the first time that the "eve is a sandbox" theme gets thrown by the wayside when game mechanics are used in an apparently unexpected way. The recent plan to near completely nerf defensive allies from the Inferno wardec system is a pretty good example of ("fairness for the attacker" trumping the sandbox of emergent gameplay and unexpected consequences) and its not the first time thats happened in the realm of hisec wardecs either. See Xetic Confederation complaining about 0.0 and wardecs in a threadnaught (old scale) that would see the war system nerfs that would last up to inferno.
But problem with all this is you can't have CCP kneejerking to intervene in the sandbox to protect one side while not doing it to protect another - thats when all the developer bias stuff begins to appear and people lose faith in the game.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 11:43:00 -
[28] - Quote
Vile rat wrote:If the people who figured this out, then told CCP while waving huge flags that read "FIX THIS OR THE ECONOMY IS SCREWED" get punished, then the only stupid thing they did was actually be dumb enough to inform CCP about the issue.
Well they could have contracted their stash and transfered the Isk to CCP Sreeg's wallet and said "read this petition it's pretty important you know." Maybe then CCP could give them a medal
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 11:46:00 -
[29] - Quote
Vile rat wrote:Also let me be perfectly blunt here. There was no bug abuse. They made the economy for faction war and they set the parameters. Everything that was done occured within the realm of legal game mechanics even if that wasn't the intention of the dev that coded this. As has been explained blapping frigates with titans wasn't intended either but was considered a legal, if abusive method of using game mechanics.
You could argure that having the value of the loot that dropped from the freighters available to process again whilst nonetheless counting in the isk value "destroyed" for LP was an abuse of a bug Vile Rat.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 11:52:00 -
[30] - Quote
Vile rat wrote:Lexmana wrote:I am baffled by the fact CCP didn't see this coming and coded a safety break in the system. It was such an obvious exploit and was called out several times by players long before release :facepalm:.
Congrats to goons for pulling this off on such a massive scale. I guess the level of damage done to the system and the estimated time for the economy to recover will guide CCP on how to proceed. I wouldn't be surprised if they called Force Majeure and reverted all/most LP earned to protect the integrity of the game. To bad FW looks more broken than ever. Well a lot of non goons profited from this as well, including noted folk hero Jade Constantine.
Well non-goons in the Minmatar Militia profited from the heroic work of our fighters and plexers who produced the beneficial battlefield situation. I know that goons have taken credit for the tier 5 warzone control status that allowed many Matari fighters to cash out their entirely legally-won LP's for beneficial rates but how much that is actually true remains to be seen. It costs about 6m lps to raise the upgrade status of 60 or systems from 1 to 5 and its possible for a single minmatar fighter to make 100,000 lps an hour plexing (or missioning) so thats 60 man hours of legit gameplay across the militia to assemble the LPs needed to do this again. Its certainly not beyond the realms of possibility for 60 people to cooperate an hours effort to do this.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 11:56:00 -
[31] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:so quick estimate yaou guys did ~200.000 clicks to get all these items. lets do a quick math: if you can do 4 clicks a second (well pretty fast, but we talking goons here) you get 50.000 seconds. Thats 833 minutes or about 14 hours of mindless clicking..... Well i gratulate you on 14 Hours of mindless clicking in the FW-LP-Store.....if nothinmg else, thats an abuse of your mouse-finger for sure!
I think its claimed they used a G15 keyboard macro to achieve this amazing feat of patience. (but its okay because unlike macro-mining thats not actually against the game rules)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2488
|
Posted - 2012.06.22 12:01:00 -
[32] - Quote
Rudgier Thorrin wrote:Gun Gal wrote:No matter how you cut it, finding a bug, not reporting it, and exploiting it is wrong. It would be a bug if they could create ISK from thin air.
Initially that is exactly what was happening though ...
To repeat. When you kill a ship in faction warfare (belonging to the enemy faction) you get loyalty points awarded equal to the value of the ship + cargo. These freighters that were being killed on alts were awarding loyalty point payouts (for the kill) that also counted in the cargo that had dropped in space (and thus could be added to a future kill and payout). That really is double counting and is creating (if not isk) then loyalty points that can be turned into isk (from thin air.)
That (as I understand it) was the bug that got fixed early, but I didn't see any note in the op post suggesting that LP has been removed from the game - its even referred to as "seed" (or foundation) LP for the continuing scheme.
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Jade Constantine
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:05:00 -
[33] - Quote
Vokanic wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Vile rat wrote:Also let me be perfectly blunt here. There was no bug abuse. They made the economy for faction war and they set the parameters. Everything that was done occured within the realm of legal game mechanics even if that wasn't the intention of the dev that coded this. As has been explained blapping frigates with titans wasn't intended either but was considered a legal, if abusive method of using game mechanics. You could argure that having the value of the loot that dropped from the freighters available to process again whilst nonetheless counting in the isk value "destroyed" for LP was an abuse of a bug Vile Vat. You could argue that if Goons get Sreeg'd, you're next in line.
Well hardly, I (and the rest of the Minmatar Militia) made our LP quite legally. You could say we benefitted from the tier 5 loyalty point store (and we did) but it would be quite easy to deduct the 6m loyalty points from any sum reclaimed from goons to justify that saturday's levels. It is after all, a tiny drop in the ocean.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:10:00 -
[34] - Quote
Mabego Tetrimon wrote:well, Eula break again guy: "3. You may not use stored rapid keystrokes that facilitate acquisition of items at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play"
I do have a recollection that CCP specifically said that G15-19 whatever keyboards don't break the eula on macros previously - but I also agree this is a probably a pretty significant edge case ... because yep, by the wording of that part of the eula its precisley what happened.
Interesting to see what the judgement will be on that really - I have no idea.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:12:00 -
[35] - Quote
Aareya wrote:Tallian Saotome wrote:THERE WAS NO BUG. Just a poorly thought out formula, which was pointed out by multiple people many times prior to going live. CCP knew it was there, or is still ignoring the userbase(which they claim to have learned not to do). This deserves emphasis.
It really doesn't because there was clearly a bug in the initial double-counting of LP for "destruction" even when parts of the loot dropped. This WAS A BUG. People really need to read a little more closely.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:17:00 -
[36] - Quote
Well you could say that using your $200 keyboard in certain ways is quite okay, but admitting to using it to make 20,000 keypresses in a half dozen hours of automatic "click button get loot" action isn't okay. That really does fall directly into the Eula clause quoted above. I mean lets be honest, it really does - you'd need a pretty top lawyer to argue your way out of that conviction.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:21:00 -
[37] - Quote
Bagehi wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Vokanic wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Vile rat wrote:Also let me be perfectly blunt here. There was no bug abuse. They made the economy for faction war and they set the parameters. Everything that was done occured within the realm of legal game mechanics even if that wasn't the intention of the dev that coded this. As has been explained blapping frigates with titans wasn't intended either but was considered a legal, if abusive method of using game mechanics. You could argure that having the value of the loot that dropped from the freighters available to process again whilst nonetheless counting in the isk value "destroyed" for LP was an abuse of a bug Vile Vat. You could argue that if Goons get Sreeg'd, you're next in line. Well hardly, I (and the rest of the Minmatar Militia) made our LP quite legally. You could say we benefitted from the tier 5 loyalty point store (and we did) but it would be quite easy to deduct the 6m loyalty points from any sum reclaimed from goons to justify that saturday's levels. It is after all, a tiny drop in the ocean. Soooo... if CCP were to revert everything the goons did... does this mean AMARR VICTOR!?!?!
Hardly, because it wouldn't revert the system ownership and goons had precisely nothing to do with actually playing the territorial conquest aspect of FW. At worst it would lead to reduction in tiers in the warzone control that Minmatar players would need to put right with a collective 60 man hours of effort across the milita ... tbh, I can put in my two hours later on :) another 29 pilots and we're golden.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:23:00 -
[38] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:Why am I not surprised to find Jade in this thread, 51 pages on, trying everything he can to paint GSF in a bad light?
I'm really not, I'm trying to be pretty fair, if you can't see that then pfft, sorry mate you really are like that dude at the end of apocalypse now.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:33:00 -
[39] - Quote
Vokanic wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Well you could say that using your $200 keyboard in certain ways is quite okay, but admitting to using it to make 20,000 keypresses in a half dozen hours of automatic "click button get loot" action isn't okay. That really does fall directly into the Eula clause quoted above. I mean lets be honest, it really does - you'd need a pretty top lawyer to argue your way out of that conviction. How did it accelerate acquisition? A person wants to buy 100 implants, at once, from the LP store. They have the LP to do so. The limitations of the system prevent them from doing so. End of the day, the LP wasn't acquired via macros. they got the same amount regardless if they use them or not. Unless you'd like to argue that waiting for market transactions to process is 'game play'
Well, it takes a lot of keypresses, previously when I've bought datacores from the loyalty point store I've spent 15 mins getting a few thousand out, gotten bored and then shrugged and blown my lps on fleet stabbers instead.
One can assume that most players would draw the line at sitting at their keyboard clicking accept for 14 hours and consider it a pretty poor return for their gaming enjoyment. If a keyboard marco was used to automate that process of collecting goodies then sure ... it kinda is facilitating the acquisition of items at an accelerated rate because I don't think you actually could match a keyboard macro for FOURTEEN HOURS of manual clicking!
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:38:00 -
[40] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:I really don't see why one isn't simply able to type in a desired quantity of a given item in the LP store. You have the LP, you have the ISK - why not? v0v
I don't disagree. The current interface is a joke. But thats as may be, - its a joke that everyone has to put up with. If in this case (and we obviously don't know for sure) 14 hours of manual clicking accept has been bypassed by use of a keyboard macro - that probably is a clear case of gaining an unfair advantage through automation and should trigger the eula clause.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:44:00 -
[41] - Quote
Tallian Saotome wrote: The LP for dropped item was a bug, it was reported and almost immediately fixed. And yes, you are allowed to test a bug as 'Proof of concept' before reporting it, as long as you are not going out of your way to exploit it. You are even allowed to gain an advantage during the process of proving it, but this is the ONE place in the entire scheme that might be sketchy.
Aryth wrote: (from the op) The test quickly became even bigger than anticipated because upon release, FW turned out to have a bug that rewarded LP for both dropped and exploded cargo, doubling the rewards. So we went to work, sending hundreds of billions of ISK worth of highend minerals to Yulai to be blown up. Why Yulai? Anyone enlisted in faction warfare gets shot at by faction police of the opposing factions. Yulai and its entire constellation are owned by CONCORD, which is neutral territory. Thus, both FW alts could move through peacefully. Also, Yulai has an GÇ£Inner CircleGÇ¥ station, which was just plain funny. How fitting that Yulai, once the most important system in Eve, finally becomes relevant again. CCP reacted quickly and patched this out, but the damage was done (not that it really mattered since it would merely have delayed the inevitable); the cabal had our GÇ£seedGÇ¥ LP.
This quote from the op makes it pretty clear that there was a bug that "doubled the rewards" and though CCP patched the bug out "the damage was done" and the cabal had the "seed LP" for the scheme.
I guess there is a question (that only CCP can answer in their internal enquiry) of whether this bug was reported by the op at the time it was being used to gain the seed LP for the ongoing project.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:50:00 -
[42] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:That means you guys were amongst the last to know ... thats actually quite funny. I'm actually 100% certain you're 100% full of ****. But again, please do keep on pouring on the damage control, you're pretty bad at it.
https://twitter.com/EVEAryth/status/215233678631116801
any comments?
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Jade Constantine
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Posted - 2012.06.22 12:56:00 -
[43] - Quote
Well best GM reply I could find.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=889308#post889308
Quote:GM Lelouch wrote:
Hello there,
To make a long story short, automation of gameplay is not permitted; players must be manually issuing the commands to control their character(s) at all times.
Our stance on programs such as Synergy and hardware/software combination such as the G15 keyboard is that they can be legitimately used as long as gameplay isn't automated. Synergy allows you to move your mouse cursor to multiple different monitors which are hooked up to different computers and we do not have any qualms with players using the program for this purpose. If Synergy was used in some way to control your accounts for you without a need for you to be at your keyboard, then that would not be allowed, but I am not aware of such a functionality with this program. If Synergy is used in conjunction with some other program to automate gameplay, it would not be permitted. G15 "macros" which allow you to group different commands into one keypress are allowed. For example, setting your G1 key to press F1, F2, F3 and so on for you with one key press is allowed (although this specific command is not as useful as it was before now that we have weapon grouping).
An exceedingly complex G15 macro which would effectively automate gameplay, such as mining, without a need for the player to be present at his keyboard would be against the EULA, regardless of whether the player utilizing said macro is sitting at his keyboard at the time!
Lastly, multiboxing is allowed, and programs designed for multiboxing in mind which allow a player to manually issue the same command to multiple game clients at the same time are allowed. In the same vein as what has been stated above, the player must be manually sending the commands; if a program is automating those commands for you, then it would be considered a breach of our EULA.
I hope this clears up this matter.
Best regards, Senior GM Lelouch EVE Online Customer Support
Its not really a perfect judgement because obviously automating a mouse click followed by a "enter" is not really complex - but it is automating a process that would not require you to be at your keyboard for 14 hours.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 13:59:00 -
[44] - Quote
Carlos Aranda wrote: I have a problem to understand this whole claimed LP shop heist by Goons.
If I look at the items, which the Goons should have purchased in the Minmatar LP shop, they are not crashed yet. So either the Goons lied about the magnitude of their LP shop heist or they still have most of the items, they exchanged in the Fw shop in their hangars or have not exchanged the LPs in anything so far. This would lead to the next question: What will they do with it, if they really have it? Will we see Goon fleets with Republic fleet equipment and with +5 implants and hardwirings in their pods? Will they try to feed their stocks of RF items slowly in the market?
I also do not quite understand in general, what Goons do with their ISKs. We not know, how much money Goons really made out of FW shop manipulations. We do know exactly, they sit on a monopol of Tech. Surprisingly we do not see any of this ISK. Goons still fly the same crappy fleet set ups like a few months ago, while other alliances fly t3 and have still way more Supercapitals. Others also have of course ship reimbursement programs. In other words, the wealth does not reach the average Goon. Where is that money?
The answer to your question is that the goon leadership will be paying their eve subs with plex for about 17,000 years.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 18:50:00 -
[45] - Quote
Pisov viet wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:I keep waiting for PA to explain how you can design a system specifically to work in a way other than intended. Just like we wait for jade to tell us how LP create isk?
You will need to link me to the post where I said that.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 19:01:00 -
[46] - Quote
Pisov viet wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Pisov viet wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:I keep waiting for PA to explain how you can design a system specifically to work in a way other than intended. Just like we wait for jade to tell us how LP create isk? You will need to link me to the post where I said that. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1516782#post1516782Jade Constantine wrote: Initially that is exactly what was happening though ...
To repeat. When you kill a ship in faction warfare (belonging to the enemy faction) you get loyalty points awarded equal to the value of the ship + cargo. These freighters that were being killed on alts were awarding loyalty point payouts (for the kill) that also counted in the cargo that had dropped in space (and thus could be added to a future kill and payout). That really is double counting and is creating (if not isk) then loyalty points that can be turned into isk (from thin air.)
That (as I understand it) was the bug that got fixed early, but I didn't see any note in the op post suggesting that LP has been removed from the game - its even referred to as "seed" (or foundation) LP for the continuing scheme.
Learn to edit.
I think you need to read better.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 19:04:00 -
[47] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:then loyalty points that can be turned into isk (from thin air.) Tell us more about how loyalty points can be turned into isk from thin air.
Why would I do that when the full quote clearly doesn't make that claim. You are just being silly.
I was staying the bug effectively doubled LP "from thin air" because it was double counting LP on stuff from the killmail (while allowing the looted cargo to be counted again in the next killmail) LP can be turned into isk (by getting items that can be sold on the market) - I'm really sure what point you are trying to make.
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Posted - 2012.06.22 19:11:00 -
[48] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:then loyalty points that can be turned into isk (from thin air.) Tell us more about how loyalty points can be turned into isk from thin air. Why would I do that when the full quote clearly doesn't make that claim. You are just being silly. Oh really, it clearly states "then loyalty points that can be turned into isk (from thin air). Tell me more about how loyalty points can be turned into isk (from thin air).
You chopped off the end of a statement to try to twist its meaning into something else. Is this amateur hour at the mass debating society or something?
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Posted - 2012.06.23 02:21:00 -
[49] - Quote
Xython wrote:Pr1ncess Alia wrote:they didn't help them fix the bug. they helped their wallets with the bug until ccp fixed it. there is a difference. So the only people allowed to make bug reports are those willing to fly to Iceland and donate their time as computer programmers? You make less and less sense the more you talk, PrONEncess Alia.
You do know its possible to report a bug without spending a month on a grand james bond villain-esq plan to exploit the bug and announce how incredibly clever you were for exploiting it on the eve online forums right ?
Just checking.
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Posted - 2012.06.23 02:34:00 -
[50] - Quote
Aryth wrote:Pr1ncess Alia wrote: save the crying for when they don't give stuff back they should have. until then, they probably will return unrelated stuff
Given CCP's past trackrecord of false positives for RMT, and now taking assets that had nothing to do with FW because they were the same asset type, well, I don't have a lot of faith in their ability to do anything of the sort. The greater issue is. This means combining mechanics in EVE to an unforseen outcome is an exploit. Forget the ISK for a second. This means EVE is not the EVE we thought it was. Read the thread, many people feel this is well within the mechanics. I would say most have voiced their support. If it's such a grey area, that the majority of people believe it to be legit, for CCP to do something like this is chilling indeed. I respect their right to maintain the sandbox. But my personal opinion is they are not the same company they were. This was well within bounds. That is a sad thing for EVE.
To be honest Aryth. I said I thought your market manipulation to game the value of lp-derived items on the lp payout for ship kill was pretty imaginative stuff (selling low valued nonsense commodities to each other to make the average price go up). I applauded the creativity really - but I think we both know that kind of thing can't stand on the scale you did it on - the integrity of the game universe for everyone else is important - and there is a default unwitten rule of any game (that even transcends the eula) "don't take the ****."
In addition, I think you stretched things beyond breaking with the double-counting of LP (getting awarded kill lp for stuff that dropped as cargo so you could do it again) - regardless of how much lp that actually created there is a principle there that it was clearly dodgy.
And arguably if you did use a G15/19 style keyboard to automate the collection of items from the loyalty point store thats also effectively cheating by the rules of the game (certainly by my interpretation of the gm decisions on macro programming keyboards).
I think threatening CCP with bad publicity (viral bad vibes) etc at this point won't do you guys any good at all. Public opinion is always fascinated by scandal and heists like this - but sympathy never really lasts for people who effectively cheated at the game (on the assumption thats the judgement of course.)
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Posted - 2012.06.23 02:37:00 -
[51] - Quote
Paint wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Xython wrote:Pr1ncess Alia wrote:they didn't help them fix the bug. they helped their wallets with the bug until ccp fixed it. there is a difference. So the only people allowed to make bug reports are those willing to fly to Iceland and donate their time as computer programmers? You make less and less sense the more you talk, PrONEncess Alia. You do know its possible to report a bug without spending a month on a grand james bond villain-esq plan to exploit the bug and announce how incredibly clever you were for exploiting it on the eve online forums right ? Just checking. It was reported, even funnier you apparently knew about it before it was reported here and didn't report it either. Good job!
You chaps really need to learn to follow the sequence of events. Arth tweeted his plan at CCP Punkaris. Everyone else who got an early sight of the document saw it at that point. Of course the heroic comrades of the TLF had made their cash-outs completely oblivious to these shennanigans some days before on saturday afternoon when they traded their legally-obtained LP's favourably on the tier 5 LP store. All in all you could call it a happy coincidence.
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Posted - 2012.06.23 03:20:00 -
[52] - Quote
Pinky Feldman wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Xython wrote:Pr1ncess Alia wrote:they didn't help them fix the bug. they helped their wallets with the bug until ccp fixed it. there is a difference. So the only people allowed to make bug reports are those willing to fly to Iceland and donate their time as computer programmers? You make less and less sense the more you talk, PrONEncess Alia. You do know its possible to report a bug without spending a month on a grand james bond villain-esq plan to exploit the bug and announce how incredibly clever you were for exploiting it on the eve online forums right ? Just checking. So would you say that it would be also fair to punish the Minmatar militia for the ridiculous amounts of ISK they made during the Goon manipulation as well? Didn't think so. Sure the Min militia as a whole didn't know about the scam as it was happening, but if its as black and white wrong like you claim it is, you should do the right thing and return the ridiculous amount of ISK that you guys profited off of it. Stop being a hypocrite.
Well how exactly do you handle a rollback like that really. CCP could give all the LP back to the minmatar characters who cashed out - and remove all the loyalty point goods they bought with it. But how do you restore the integrity of the market and get back to prices these things should be worth (without removing pretty much everything that got cashed in and sold during the weeks after inferno).
If it turned out that was a route CCP wanted to go by then fair enough. I'd be happy to see the couple of million lps that I legally earned (missions and plexes) turn up in my wallet while all the hundreds of millions of lps the rest of the militia earned turned up in theirs.
We could then spend 6m between us to put the store to tier 5 again and cash out again. (returning our hangers to the same approximate state they currently are in).
But thats a lot of GM time and effort to clean up after the goons really
Here's the thing Pinky. Regardless of the goon-manipulation the TLF is capable of taking the minmatar store to tier 5 at any time simply by spending 6m collectively. Six fairly average FW players have that much. Its possible to do this because the Minmatar faction won faction war pretty honestly prior to inferno.
So my question to you is if you think its worth CCP's time to go through everyone's hanger and remove the proceeds of saturday's cashout and turn it back into LP's just so we can collectively jump the store back to tier 5 and cash out again?
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Posted - 2012.06.23 03:45:00 -
[53] - Quote
Xython wrote:Paint wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Xython wrote:Pr1ncess Alia wrote:they didn't help them fix the bug. they helped their wallets with the bug until ccp fixed it. there is a difference. So the only people allowed to make bug reports are those willing to fly to Iceland and donate their time as computer programmers? You make less and less sense the more you talk, PrONEncess Alia. You do know its possible to report a bug without spending a month on a grand james bond villain-esq plan to exploit the bug and announce how incredibly clever you were for exploiting it on the eve online forums right ? Just checking. It was reported, even funnier you apparently knew about it before it was reported here and didn't report it either. Good job! Not only that, Jadeykins exploited almost 9 billion ISK before CCP stepped in. Pot, meet kettle! :D
You shouldn't tell lies or spread nasty rumours about other Eve players.
Protip Buying things with legally earned LP from the loyalty point store is not "exploiting."
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Posted - 2012.06.23 03:56:00 -
[54] - Quote
Xython wrote:Cygnet Lythanea wrote:Gul'gotha Derv'ash wrote: Burn Jita did just about **** all to the markets, and from my understanding, didn't really "inflict mass suffering" on anyone other than yourselves. People knew it was happening so they avoided the system for the most part. You just wasted a large portion of time because you threw a temper tantrum over Mittani getting a slap on the wrist for trying to coax everyone to get a guy to kill himself.
Yeah, they killed fifty freighters over a period of several days. I noticed that quite a few of them stopped posting when I pointed out that was a tiny fraction of Jita's usual daily traffic, and most people just went around. That's funny, we also noticed the "LOL GEWNS" guys shutting up pretty damned quick when CCP posted a devblog about it stating that trading in Jita was down what, 50% that weekend? Not bad for a test run. Now if only we had, say, 5 trillion ISK laying around for a nice month long go at it... Right around the time the wardec changes were messed with again making it hard to wardec us and screw with our fun...
If you did that I might be able to convince CCP soundwave to revert the wardec changes to 1.0 (or better yet) actually produce a decent compromise on the 1.1 fix that didn't massively disadvantage smaller alliances fighting much larger aggressors with the aid of hisec allies.
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Posted - 2012.06.23 04:24:00 -
[55] - Quote
Xython wrote: You bragged about exploiting the wardec changes. You knew they were going to be fixed, including a "get out of responsibility free" card in your post -- claiming if they were fixed, it was cause supposedly cried to CCP. They were fixed. You claimed we cried to CCP. Evidence that we actually were looking forward to the foreverwar was ignored in lieu of the lie pubbies tell themselves so they can sleep at night.
You need to stop falsely accusing people of "exploitng". We did absolutely nothing with wardecs that was not discussed in the inferno 1.0 wardec devblog. Your directors weclomed the 1.1 changes in the various threads - your allies in TEST also. So while I do appreciate you need to put on a big brave "come at me bro" face when discussing wardecs - the reality is a little less pugnacious.
Xython wrote: Let it go. The game isn't fair in such a way that a 100 man alliance can fight off a 7000 man alliance. Nor is it designed to be unbalanced in such a way. And trying to bleat and moan until CCP somehow makes it "fair" like that is never going to happen, because that's stupid on a level that almost matches the stupidity of people who run 23 ice miner bot accounts at the same time.
So is it fair or unfair in favour of the largest alliances in the game that its going to be impossible for a defensive coalition to come close to matching the numbers an aggressor can bring to war for a nominal payment of 50m isk per week? I think you are mixing up definitions - is eve Fair (thus its unfair that small guys can fight back) or Unfair (but specially fair on the largest). I'm confused to be honest. I can't really decide whether eve is supposed to be "fair" or not. Or if its only supposed to be "fair" for some and "unfair" for others.
Xython wrote: If you want to fight Goonswarm like that, make your own alliance. Come visit VFK with 254 of your closest friends. We'll leave the light on for you.
Hey you wardecced us. Don't try and split away now with all that "come and fight us in 0.0 guff" - I did my best to arrange a welcoming committe for the swarm in hisec so don't go running away now.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2496
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 04:38:00 -
[56] - Quote
Mortimer Civeri wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:
If you did that I might be able to convince CCP soundwave to revert the wardec changes to 1.0 (or better yet) actually produce a decent compromise on the 1.1 fix that didn't massively disadvantage smaller alliances fighting much larger aggressors with the aid of hisec allies.
Well, if you wouldn't "hire" any three person corp, with people barely able to press F1, onto your little wardec, you might find that actually hiring competent mercs might prove useful.
Hardly. The guys I've allowed into the wardec currently are kicking the goons into next year. Why the heck would I pay "competant" mercs a penny when the goons themselves only pay 50m a week?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2497
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 04:53:00 -
[57] - Quote
Paint wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Mortimer Civeri wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:
If you did that I might be able to convince CCP soundwave to revert the wardec changes to 1.0 (or better yet) actually produce a decent compromise on the 1.1 fix that didn't massively disadvantage smaller alliances fighting much larger aggressors with the aid of hisec allies.
Well, if you wouldn't "hire" any three person corp, with people barely able to press F1, onto your little wardec, you might find that actually hiring competent mercs might prove useful. Hardly. The guys I've allowed into the wardec currently are kicking the goons into next year. Why the heck would I pay "competant" mercs a penny when the goons themselves only pay 50m a week? I am just curious - where can I see the killboard for this war and why haven't I seen you ever at vfk? To be clear I want to compare it to our other endeavors because unlike you, goonswarm is not afraid to lose a lot of ships to proove a point and, ultimately, win. But you are obviously too stupid to pick up on that. edit - a very quick look at http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&view=kills&plt_id=7743&m=6&y=2012 shows little or no goon kills. Yep you sure are owning us all right.
Pretty much putting a bag over your heads and kicking your alliance down the stairs currently.
The Killboard is ingame and anyone can see it by searching for the "Goonswarm Federation vs The Star Fraction" war on the wars browser. Current situation is very much in our favour as you will see. Unfortunately CCP have decided to nerf defensive wardecs with the 1.1 patch so our allied coalition is unsustainable. By strange coincidence it will cost the princely sum of 5 Trillion ISK every 2 weeks if we wanted to continue the war on this scale.
As for why we haven't visited you in VFK. Well thats pretty straightforward. You WARDECCED US! That means you have to do the work and come and hunt your enemies not sit on your lazy moon-goo-sucking backsides like some kinda of Jabba-the-hutt crimelords while we come to you!
Good heavens, you chaps really don't understand this whole war thing.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
2507
|
Posted - 2012.06.23 14:53:00 -
[58] - Quote
Paint wrote: So you have no kills. OK Edit - I will freely admit I don't pay much attention to wars but when I look at the war browser, unless I am missing something, which is completely possible, it shows no kills. But please do feel free to show me kills and losses from the war. Especially yours. This seems important to you.
Look at the "Goonswarm Federation vs Star Fraction" war in the online war browser. It comes an overview of the campaign so far.
(Starting 31/05/2012) Current results are The Star Fraction coalition 14b isk killed and 110 ships blown up. (winning) vs Goonswarm Federation with 1.7b isk killed and 26 ships blown up (losing).
Now sure, I've not scored a personal kill in this particular war (its not our only one I've got 302 kills vs the Amarrians btw) But then neither has Mittani (and it was his big griefing initiative I thought.) In fact the only goons I've actually in space since you declared war have been 3 cowardly stealth bombers who all instantly fled from me when I locked them with a tornado.
So here's the thing. When you declare war on an entity the onus is on you to come disrupt their operations and make yourselves a pain. What's happened here is that I countered your dec by inviting hisec trade hub raiders in for free as allowed in the 1.0 wardec system and you guys are getting farmed by hisec players. You haven't had the slightest impact on Star Fraction playstyle or our own war against Amarrian Faction warfare.
And its pretty hypocritical for you to somehow think I should be personally fighting Mittani's "griefing war" when your leader isn't.
Where is Mittani on the killboard? Hiding as usual.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom Epic Inferno Wardec Test, Sign up and shoot Goons for free! |
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